Naming classical music

[nicholson2002]

I have recently purchased dBpoweramp and I now wish to start the process of digitising my eclectic CD collection. I have been reading everything I can get my hands on to try and understand more about naming conventions within DBPA and how I can make best use of them but I’m at a bit of a loss about where to start. I would very much appreciate your help.

In principle, I want to move completely away from the concept of music classified by the CD from whence it came and more towards the music being organised as a specific body of work. So, for example, I have a 10CD collection entitled “The British Symphonic Collection” that includes music from various composers, conducted by various conductors, various orchestras and at various times.

In this example, (I think) I want the following folder and file structure on my Mac:

Media/Music/Composer/Work/Conductor/Track

So, for the above example, I would expect:

Media/Music/Cowen Frederic/Symphony No 6/Bostock Douglas/…….

Put another way, I am trying to organise my music on the basis of the way I think about the music I want to hear at that moment and organise it accordingly. When I decide I want to listen to a piece of music I typically focus on the genre first (eg am I in a Mozart or a Guns n Roses mood) then (assuming I've opted for Mozart) the composer, then the particular piece of work and then the conductor/orchestra. I don’t care about the CD name or its number or any other aspect of the original media.

My problem is how I get there. I am a total noob at this and I desperately need help, at least to get me to the point where I can try and do some fine-tuning myself. I welcome any and all advice as well as some specific naming code for dBpoweramp that will get me going.

Thanks

[mville]

Re: Naming classical music

You will have to edit the default Naming string to include the tags you want e.g. composer, work and conductor. The default is currently based on the album, album artist and artist tags.

See dBpoweramp Naming

[nicholson2002]

Re: Naming classical music

Thanks mville.

As you suggest, I have edited the default Naming string as follows:

[IFVALUE]composer,[composer],[IFCOMP]Various Artists[][IF!COMP][artist][][]/[album]/[track] [artist] - [title]

This has given me:

Frederic H. Cowen
....Cowen: Symphony No. 6 in E major 'The idyllic":
........Douglas Bostock - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic"): 1. Allegro vivace - animato.flac
........Douglas Bostock - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic"): 2. Allegro scherzando - tranquillo.flac
........etc, etc

That is much closer to what I want but I still want to simplify it. Using the above example, this is what I would like to achieve (I'm a firm believer in the KISS principle):

Cowen, Frederic
....Symphony No. 6 in E major 'The Idyllic" - Douglas Bostock
........1. Allegro vivace - animato.flac
........2. Allegro scherzando - tranquillo.flac
........etc, etc

I've tried to achieve this outcome by playing with the naming string but without much success. Any help you, or anyone else, could give me would be greatly appreciated. I'm guessing that I won't be able to get to where I want to be purely through automated naming but the less manual adjustments I have to make the better.

John

[mfmccann]

Re: Naming classical music

I wish one of the Gurus would respond to this thread. For Classical music, it is germane. I'm trying to create folders (e.g. Ludwig von Beethoven) which include folders with each of his works (e.g. Symphony 3 'Eroica') with each folder (since there are several Eroica's in my collection with the Conductor's or Artist's or Album Artist's name (or the performance date - thinking of Glen Gould's different versions of the Goldberg Variations) in them. I can rename folders and move items after ripping (so that Symphony 5 is not in the same folder with Symphony 3), but I'm still struggling with the logic of naming classical works (and the Naming Tutorial is not helpful for those of us who care about Classical music IMHO).

I'm currently experimenting with this Naming [IFVALUE]composer,[composer],[IFCOMP]Various Artists[][IF!COMP][artist][][]/[album]/[album] [track] - [title] mostly so I will see the album name in the player as the pieces are playing. I suspect this might lead to excessively long names - but this is my current experiment.

[garym]

Re: Naming classical music

I'm having trouble following your example. One thing that would help is if you provide a listing of TAG VALUES you are using. Example (I think):

Composer: Frederic Cowen
Album: Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")
Artist: Douglas Bostock
Title: Allegro vivace

that sort of thing. Plus, your posted dynamic naming string doesn't appear to be what you used to get output. Your output shows a "1. xxxx" using the track number and a ".", but your dynamic naming string just shows [track] [artist] with no period after track.

edit: and to get composer as Cowen, Frederic you'll need to use [composersort] tag (if such a thing exists, not sure....like an [artistsort] tag)

[nicholson2002]

Re: Naming classical music

I am very new at this and readily admit that I don't know what I don't know. I apologise if I sound a little obtuse.

Within the CD Ripper (Mac version) I have entered the naming value as: [IFVALUE]composer,[composer],[IFCOMP]Various Artists[][IF!COMP][artist][][]/[album]/[track] [artist] - [title].

As a result, I am getting the following file structure in Finder for the CD I am ripping:

Frederick Cowen
...Cowen: Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")
......01 Douglas Bostock - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic"); 1. Allegro vivace

That is not bad but not really what I want. I want the following - (CAPITALS are for explanatory purposes only and are not part of the folder name):

Cowen, Frederic (THE COMPOSER)
....Symphony No. 6 in E major 'The Idyllic" - Douglas Bostock, Munich Symphony Orchestra (THE WORK PLUS THE CONDUCTOR & ORCHESTRA)
........1. Allegro vivace.flac (THE FIRST TRACK)
........2. Allegro scherzando.flac (THE SECOND TRACK)
........etc, etc

Am I being any clearer? I do appreciate your help.

[garym]

Re: Naming classical music

Understand. there's a bit of learning curve here for sure. Question, is "1. Allegro vivace" the actual title of the track that shows up in the metadata (tag) for TITLE? Otherwise, I'm not sure where the "1. " is coming from.

[mville]

Re: Naming classical music

Within the CD Ripper (Mac version) I have entered the naming value as: [IFVALUE]composer,[composer],[IFCOMP]Various Artists[][IF!COMP][artist][][]/[album]/[track] [artist] - [title].

As a result, I am getting the following file structure in Finder for the CD I am ripping:

Frederick Cowen
...Cowen: Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")
......01 Douglas Bostock - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic"); 1. Allegro vivace

To better understand what is going on, can you post a screenshot of the Edit ID-Tag window for Track 01 of the above CD.

Please include the following tags:
Composer
Composer Sort
Artist
Artist Sort
Album
Track
Title

[nicholson2002]

Re: Naming classical music

Understand. there's a bit of learning curve here for sure. Question, is "1. Allegro vivace" the actual title of the track that shows up in the metadata (tag) for TITLE? Otherwise, I'm not sure where the "1. " is coming from.

Yes, the four movements of this particular symphony are numbered 1-4 in the name itself. I have actually removed these unnecessary numbers from the folder record.

[garym]

Re: Naming classical music

Yes, the four movements of this particular symphony are numbered 1-4 in the name itself. I have actually removed these unnecessary numbers from the folder record.

OK. understand. Now provide what mville asked about above and we'll be getting somewhere. I'm sure the exact format you want can be done, assuming you have the info in the tags.

[nicholson2002]

Re: Naming classical music

To better understand what is going on, can you post a screenshot of the Edit ID-Tag window for Track 01 of the above CD.

Please include the following tags:
Composer
Composer Sort
Artist
Artist Sort
Album
Track
Title

I think the changes you suggested have got me to a place from which I can move forward. My major issue now is to see if I can make further improvements. For example:

(1) How do I automatically change the composer/artist naming to Last Name/First Name? I expect the answer to this (based on what Spoon has said) is that I can't. Disappointing, but there it is.
(2) How do I remove the composer's name from the start of the Work naming? ie remove "Cowen" from "Cowen: Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")".
(3) For each individual track, how do I remove everything up to "Allegro vivace.flac".

Any suggestions on any of these would be very welcome.

[garym]

Re: Naming classical music

I think the changes you suggested have got me to a place from which I can move forward. My major issue now is to see if I can make further improvements. For example:

(1) How do I automatically change the composer/artist naming to Last Name/First Name? I expect the answer to this (based on what Spoon has said) is that I can't. Disappointing, but there it is.
(2) How do I remove the composer's name from the start of the Work naming? ie remove "Cowen" from "Cowen: Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")".
(3) For each individual track, how do I remove everything up to "Allegro vivace.flac".

Any suggestions on any of these would be very welcome.

it would really help us if you would do the screenshot of the tags. then we can help with suggested code for dynamic naming. The questions your asking require we know more (i.e., first name, last name all relates to the artistsort tags, etc.)

[nicholson2002]

Re: Naming classical music

I'm struggling on this a bit. I don't know if it is relevant but I'm using the Mac version of dBpa and I can't seem to find the Edit ID-Tag window. Here's what I can find.

Within the Options of Meta Data & ID Tag I have a number of tick box options under Write ID Tags: For the items you mentioned, this is what I have however I doubt that this is what you are asking:

Composer - Ticked
Composer Sort - NOT ticked
Artist - No Option provided
Artist Sort - NOT ticked
Album - No Option provided
Track - No Option provided
Title - No Option provided

If I look at the metadata for Track 1 I get the following information, which also doesn't look to be what you ask:

Composer - Frederic Cowen
Composer Sort - Cowen, Frederic
Artist - Douglas Bostock
Artist Sort - No Option provided
Album - No Option provided
Track - No Option provided
Title - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")

If I "Review metadata of the currently inserted disk" I get the following:

Composer - Frederic Cowen
Composer Sort - No option provided
Artist - Douglas Bostock
Artist Sort - No Option provided
Album - Cowen: Symphony No. 6 in E major 'The idyllic"
Track - No Option provided
Title - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")

Yet again, I can't see that this is right.

Finally, if I right click on Track 1 within the Finder folder that I have now adjusted to want I want (ie Media/Music/Cowan , Frederic/Symphony No. 6, etc/allegro vivace.flac) and Edit Tags with dBpoweramp, I get the following information. Again, I doubt that this is what you are asking me.

Composer - Cowen, Frederic
Composer Sort - No Option provided
Artist - Empty
Artist Sort - No Option provided
Album - Symphony No. 6 in E major ("The Idyllic")
Track - 01
Title - Allegro vivace

This is sending me insane!!

[garym]

Re: Naming classical music

Try this. (note these are BACKSLASHES not forward slashes).

[IFVALUE]composer,[composer],[IFCOMP]Various Artists[][IF!COMP][artist][][]\[album]\[track] - [title]

But I thought you wanted the directory with album to include artist or conductor. There is a conductor tag. Make sure you have this tag filled in with conductor name.* Then you would then use this:

[IFVALUE]composer,[composer],[IFCOMP]Various Artists[][IF!COMP][artist][][]\[album] - [conductor]\[track] - [title]

*there is also an orchestra tag. I suspect you should fill this in when ripping as well, even if you don't use it in the file/directory naming.

Tagging and organizing classical music is the greatest challenge in ripping CDs. There are 100s of threads on this at various music forums. It is largely manual to get it right. But getting the tags right at the time you rip, will make everything else easier later on.

also note that you can save different profiles within dbpa when ripping (box on lower left hand side). So you can have one profile and dynamic naming for classical, another for pop, etc. that makes it easier to have dynamic naming strings that do what you want.

[garym]

Re: Naming classical music

instead use this. It puts compilation albums in a folder called various artists, then a directory for the album name, then track - title. For albums that have composer tag filled in, it puts in a directory for composer, with a subdirectory for album name, and includes conductor, then track - title underneath.

[IFCOMP]Various Artists\[album]\[track] - [title][][IF!COMP][composer]\[album] - [conductor]\[track] - [title][]