New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

[garym]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Sorry, I meant this to be a reply to Paul (monsterjazzlik), not you. He has stated on 8 October that he found the manual 'quite difficult'. I read the Setup Guide but if there is perhaps not as much advice/tips/hints/suggestions in it, then they won't be there however many times you read it, as those same things are not within my new DAP's manual either. I think Paul's suggestion of trying dBpa using the Trial period is great advice but I'd already purchased it (my decision, no problem).

One thing new users miss, is that in the program itself, on almost every page next to items are little icons with a "?" in a circle. Clicking on these will take you to related help screens that explain a lot. Be sure and do this as well to learn more.

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

The only reason for this is, that WMP doesn't report problems or errors on that level and produces faulty files. Thoses errors are sometimes hearable, sometimes not. But never the less: those copies are not bitperfect an dthat is the aim of dBpa.



You better read the original postings which are the base for Paul's knwoledge.


Dat Ei

Indeed, yes, I'm aware that WMP doesn't always do bitperfect copies and yes, that would be another benefit of persevering with dBpa particularly bearing in mind the quality of the audio equipment I use. If the problems I've experienced with Arena's 'Contagion' album are occasional then I'm happy to continue and as I've already said, on that basis, I would use the existing WMP copy if the greater demands (and quality) of dBpa don't allow a particular album/tracks to rip using dBpa.
When you refer to 'original postings', are you referring to the various threads or a particular thread? I did start reading a thread Paul sent me a link to but in common with most (if not all) threads on forums they tend to wander hither & thither (not a criticism, the wanderings are often amusing) and would it not be more helpful (and much quicker for newbies) if some/all of the useful advice was included in the Setup Guide? Could the Setup Guide not be updated/amended?
I've recently read all 545 pages (when I last looked) of a thread on a piece of hi-fi equipment before auditioning it and then buying it (it arrives in 4/5 weeks time) but that involved a £1,800 purchase so I was willing to spend a lot of time reading several thousand posts. How many threads/posts is practical/reasonable for a £36 purchase of dBpa?

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Thank you for another great suggestion, can this be one of the things added to the existing Setup Guide?

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

One thing new users miss, is that in the program itself, on almost every page next to items are little icons with a "?" in a circle. Clicking on these will take you to related help screens that explain a lot. Be sure and do this as well to learn more.

Thank you for another helpful suggestion, could this suggestion be added to the existing Setup Guide?

[mville]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Thank you for another helpful suggestion, could this suggestion be added to the existing Setup Guide?

Most users here do not work for Illustrate, so don't have access to the website. However, you can add suggestions to the Wishlist forum.

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Those WMP rips will contain errors, but as Dat Ei says, you are not hearing them.

Always very happy to improve my listening experience having invested considerably in a main hi-fi system and a Headphone system. I am hoping I got unlucky by trying to rip the Arena 'Contagion' CD right at the start of my dBpa ripping experience. I've bought a new optical drive, I will be back in action shortly having put into effect all the helpful advice set out within this Thread.

[garym]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Thank you for another helpful suggestion, could this suggestion be added to the existing Setup Guide?

We have no control over setup guide. We're just users like you. Only Spoon can edit/create an official setup guide. He tends to keep things pretty short. My advice. read, re-read, trial and error to get the outcomes your seeking, and ask specific questions here to get answers to things that you need more info on. You might prefer a more detailed guide, I might even prefer that. But my long experience with this software and forum tells me that it's not gonna happen. That said, most new users that are completely confused (and asking for better guides), figure it all out pretty quickly and within a month or two are happily ripping and tagging with no issues. There's a steep learning curve, but once through that, one rarely needs to change anything regarding their ripping steps.

p.s. Telling people in a guide that they should click on HELP buttons to learn more seems a bit too much. Seems obvious to click on "help" and ? is certainly mostly universal sign for "questions".

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Most users here do not work for Illustrate, so don't have access to the website. However, you can add suggestions to the Wishlist forum.

As a newbie, I've got my plate full with trying to learn more about dBpa so I can then progress in a more positive way. I don't have additional time/enthusiasm etc to divert into the Wishlist forum tbh. Very happy to help in this way when I've got some progress and greater knowledge under my belt. Appreciate most users here don't work for Illustrate but does someone who does work for them not keep tabs on the threads/postings? Couldn't that person notice that perhaps the same suggestions/tips/hints etc come up regularly and decide to add them to the Setup Guide?

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

We have no control over setup guide. We're just users like you. Only Spoon can edit/create an official setup guide. He tends to keep things pretty short. My advice. read, re-read, trial and error to get the outcomes your seeking, and ask specific questions here to get answers to things that you need more info on. You might prefer a more detailed guide, I might even prefer that. But my long experience with this software and forum tells me that it's not gonna happen. That said, most new users that are completely confused (and asking for better guides), figure it all out pretty quickly and within a month or two are happily ripping and tagging with no issues. There's a steep learning curve, but once through that, one rarely needs to change anything regarding their ripping steps.

p.s. Telling people in a guide that they should click on HELP buttons to learn more seems a bit too much. Seems obvious to click on "help" and ? is certainly mostly universal sign for "questions".

Fair enough, this thread is certainly part of that 'steep learning curve'. I'll keep going and I'm sure I will be a happy camper in a month or two

[Dat Ei]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Indeed, yes, I'm aware that WMP doesn't always do bitperfect copies and yes, that would be another benefit of persevering with dBpa particularly bearing in mind the quality of the audio equipment I use.

Just two points:

1.) We never know if the WMP copy is bitperfect or nearly bitperfect. We can only testify major problems which obviously reduce the audio quality (glitches, cracks etc. pp.), if we listen to the complete copy. On the other hand do we know after ripping a CD with dBpa, if a copy is bitperfect or not.

2.) Ripping errors can completely destroy your audio / listening experience, so that the Equipment itself doesn't play any role. Listening to jumps, cracks and glitches ist not a question of bad, good or superb equipment.


Dat Ei

[Oggy]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

best approach will be trying a few different CD/DVD drives.

Using very nice HP's (AKG K812's), DAP(Questyle QP2R) and a Chord Hugo 2 amp/dac, I'm very happy with the SQ of WMP. I'm very unhappy with its uselessness when it comes to metadata/album covers. So I'm very bothered about SQ generally and would love to use dBpa principally to resolve the metadata/album cover problem with WMP.

Hi ChisChas,

My first experience of dBpoweramp, was when I compared a manufacturer's top of the range CD to their, then new, Network Player. The FLAC file, was ripped, by the manufacturer recommended, dBpoweramp. Suffice to say, through a highly revealing, and full range, active system, the "ripped" file compared extremely favourably, to the then, reference CD player.

A friend uses dBpoweramp, and uses a Chord DAC, with outstanding results. A rip that give an AccurateRip, and somewhere between 95-100% of all CDs achieve this, will be passing a bit perfect stream to your DAC, so are guaranteed, the best possible sound. Some may have 2-3 frames with errors: a frame is 1/75 of a second, so I believe the occasional, and with a CD drive that is working properly, it really is occasional, longer rip time, is worth it, to give your DAC, the best possible chance to perform at its optimum.

The admittedly, steep learning curve, is well worth the effort, and once you know your preferences, and how your player works, great results can be achieved very quickly. dBpoweramp is incredibly powerful and flexible. Because of this, there are many options, some of which are not immediately obvious.

I was in your position two years ago, and thanks to the help of 3-4 people, certainly 3 of those are already giving you great advice, helped me achieve my goal, immeasurably quicker, more efficiently and smarter, than I would have, on my own. I honestly believe the product, the forum, and the help from these guys is the friendliest and best. For them to help you, you need to help them, by trying suggestions and clearly defining what you want to achieve.

One piece of advice, that certainly has saved me time, is to use Google search. I typed in Arena, Contagion, copy protected, and your thread was found immediately. Perversely, it is often quicker searching through Google, rather than through this forum.

Have you tried the Arena CD, with your new DVD drive? In my experience of ripping a couple thousand CDs, you were incredibly unlucky to not obtain an AccurateRip on all tracks. Looks an interesting album!

The CD layer of hybrid SACDs, should rip perfectly OK on either of your DVD drives: I've done several, without any issues, obtaining an AccurateRip on all tracks.

Paul's thread is well worth a read, as it shows screenshots of some settings you may find useful. Some are in CD Ripper, Settings, where album cover art sizes and embedded / Folder.jpg are discussed. If you haven't set these yet, for your preferences, then I highly recommend you do.

The default settings work very well, for most people, in most situations, but with a little more work, you may find that you can personalise, your music library, more to your liking. Use of Smart Capitalize or Capitalize All, Year and Genre, are worth considering and standardising, before ripping. Even something as straightforward, as Genre Progressive Rock, can end up having multiple variations,

[monsterjazzlick]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Thank you for coming out and saying you 'found the manual (Setup Guide) quite difficult), clearly I did too. I am encouraged (now there's a more positive approach towards me) by the help provided within this thread and hope to continue with the dBpa journey although I'm now to the wiser re future potential problems with hopefully a small % of my CD's. Personally I haven't experienced problems with my CD's or hybrid SACD's (single layer uber SACD's will only play in a SACD player and not in an optical drive) using a number of computers over the years with WMP but as I've already said, I bought dBpa for its much better metadata and album cover capability.
Would you be able/willing/available to compile a list of fairly essential amendments/additions for the Setup Guide and put them forward to the programme owner(s)/administrators?

Hi ChisChas,

I had only ever used WMP in the past for ripping circa 400 CDs about 10 years ago. My experience is best forgotten!

Basically though, WMP will appears to rip everything correctly, and leaves the end user none the wiser! I, like many others, learned this lesson the hard way. Hence I am busting a gut to do things 100% perfect this time; hence my many threads; hence my many questions, hence my many screenshots. I refuse to be bitten twice.

Personally, and I am not just saying this because I started the thread, I would work through my 40+ pages (or however many it is) a step at a time. Some questions will apply to you, while others won't (perhaps at this point in time). Regarding my own issues, I would say that I have asked every question under the sun. I would be delighted if the thread helped another newbie because everyone was so helpful; and I am sure they would feel the same.

Once you do get everything up and running, which is kinda where I am at now, then it's a matter of PRACTISING ripping over and over - until it becomes second nature. I once practised the piano at around 6 x hours per day for 5 years. Since purchasing Illustrate, I have invested the same amount of time and energy (when I get the opportunity).

I have bought two s/w's this year, this and 'Beyond Compare' (for backing up my ripped files). Two of the best s/w's I have ever purchased to date.

Hope this helps,

Paul

[mville]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Personally, and I am not just saying this because I started the thread, I would work through my 40+ pages (or however many it is) a step at a time. Some questions will apply to you, while others won't (perhaps at this point in time). Regarding my own issues, I would say that I have asked every question under the sun. I would be delighted if the thread helped another newbie because everyone was so helpful; and I am sure they would feel the same.

I can't agree with advising a newbie to read the 46 page thread which, if you read it, chops and changes all over the place and could be confusing to a newbie and to my mind, only supports the adage fail to plan, plan to fail. Don't get me wrong, there is some good info in there, it's just a shame it isn't condensed into 3 or 4 pages.

Much better IMO, to have a quick read of the Online Help Windows or Apple OS X and Spoon's Audio Guide to get an overview of the Illustrate software.

Then, try ripping 4 or 5 CDs only, including a single CD album, a multi-CD album, a compilation CD and perhaps a classical CD.

You can then see how CD Ripper works in terms of the file/folder structure (determined by Path and Naming) and how to preview/edit//write the artwork and metadata tags such as album, artist, title etc.

Once you have ripped these few CDs, check to see how the albums appear in your chosen playback system and whether you need to make any modifications to your ripping process/workflow including whether you want to use sort tags etc. This process may take 2 or 3 re-rips until your are happy, but it will help you plan your overall tagging strategy.

Only when you are happy with your ripping process/workflow, would I suggest you start ripping all your CDs. This is a time consuming process and if you don't plan, as is clear in Paul's threads, you will spend much more time having to re-think/re-tag, post rip.

[monsterjazzlick]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Hi mville,

I can't agree with advising a newbie to read the 46 page thread which, if you read it, chops and changes all over the place and could be confusing to a newbie and to my mind, only supports the adage fail to plan, plan to fail. Don't get me wrong, there is some good info in there, it's just a shame it isn't condensed into 3 or 4 pages.

I did not mean to literally work through the long thread in a strictly step-by-step fashion; because there are many twists and turns. I would have thought that ChisChas would be able to detect this flaw. But nevertheless, maybe I should have been clearer in my reply yesterday.

Only when you are happy with your ripping process/workflow, would I suggest you start ripping all your CDs. This is a time consuming process and if you don't plan, as is clear in Paul's threads, you will spend much more time having to re-think/re-tag, post rip.

The reasons for me changing my mind mid-flight were not entirely down to me having not "planned". Some reasons were because I discovered - whilst reading a historical book over the summer - clear definitions of many of the sub-genres of Jazz (Cool, Swing, Fusion, Latin). I think I began ripping in July and only found out the latter historical information around 3 weeks ago; and by then I was a good way into my ripping. Plus, I switched from a Sony Walkman to an Amazon Fire tablet device (the latter handled/ignored certain criteria differently from the former) between July and August - which was a scenario that was not possible to predict. Finally, I found that I was not able to take a look at the bigger picture (ie. a birds eye view) until I had ripped a good 20 CDs. Then I went back and changed many things which I thought I had set in stone. All of these decisions have definitely been for the better and I really do not see how I could have foretasted such decisions so early on in the ripping stage.

Paul

[ChisChas]

Re: New User Experiencing Huge Time Differences in Rips

Hi ChisChas,

My first experience of dBpoweramp, was when I compared a manufacturer's top of the range CD to their, then new, Network Player. The FLAC file, was ripped, by the manufacturer recommended, dBpoweramp. Suffice to say, through a highly revealing, and full range, active system, the "ripped" file compared extremely favourably, to the then, reference CD player.

A friend uses dBpoweramp, and uses a Chord DAC, with outstanding results. A rip that give an AccurateRip, and somewhere between 95-100% of all CDs achieve this, will be passing a bit perfect stream to your DAC, so are guaranteed, the best possible sound. Some may have 2-3 frames with errors: a frame is 1/75 of a second, so I believe the occasional, and with a CD drive that is working properly, it really is occasional, longer rip time, is worth it, to give your DAC, the best possible chance to perform at its optimum.

The admittedly, steep learning curve, is well worth the effort, and once you know your preferences, and how your player works, great results can be achieved very quickly. dBpoweramp is incredibly powerful and flexible. Because of this, there are many options, some of which are not immediately obvious.

I was in your position two years ago, and thanks to the help of 3-4 people, certainly 3 of those are already giving you great advice, helped me achieve my goal, immeasurably quicker, more efficiently and smarter, than I would have, on my own. I honestly believe the product, the forum, and the help from these guys is the friendliest and best. For them to help you, you need to help them, by trying suggestions and clearly defining what you want to achieve.

One piece of advice, that certainly has saved me time, is to use Google search. I typed in Arena, Contagion, copy protected, and your thread was found immediately. Perversely, it is often quicker searching through Google, rather than through this forum.

Have you tried the Arena CD, with your new DVD drive? In my experience of ripping a couple thousand CDs, you were incredibly unlucky to not obtain an AccurateRip on all tracks. Looks an interesting album!

The CD layer of hybrid SACDs, should rip perfectly OK on either of your DVD drives: I've done several, without any issues, obtaining an AccurateRip on all tracks.

Paul's thread is well worth a read, as it shows screenshots of some settings you may find useful. Some are in CD Ripper, Settings, where album cover art sizes and embedded / Folder.jpg are discussed. If you haven't set these yet, for your preferences, then I highly recommend you do.

The default settings work very well, for most people, in most situations, but with a little more work, you may find that you can personalise, your music library, more to your liking. Use of Smart Capitalize or Capitalize All, Year and Genre, are worth considering and standardising, before ripping. Even something as straightforward, as Genre Progressive Rock, can end up having multiple variations,

Thank you for such an encouraging post, yes, I know via another forum someone who has PM'd me and saying he uses dBpa successfully. I will reply at greater length to your post BUT the important thing is that the new Asus SDRW-08D2S-U Lite has just whizzed through track 15 on Contagion and dealt with Track 16 pretty quickly too. Phew............