re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

[Gio-Gio]

Hello,

I see that with some CD dBpoweramp does a first ripping whose progress is showed in %, and then something which is showed as "re-rip" with a countdown of frames.
This last one is VERY slow, so slow that finally the ripping lasts longer than on EAC (and I passed to dB for speed, because I must rip +++ CDs).
I do not understand why this happens only with some CDs.
I have changed all possible options and it still happens.

What is this, why do I need it, and how can I avoid it?

Thanks!

[mville]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

The CD has errors (could be a scratched CD or CD manufacturing errors) and CDRipper is re-reading the frames with errors.

The relevant settings are found in CDRipper >> Options >> Secure Settings

[Gio-Gio]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

strange, it happens also with cd with absolute no scratch and which EAC rips in much lesser time and with no errors and verified accurate rip.
Ok, done another test, NO WAY, this must be solved, this is not normal. I had to stop the ripping because it was already 27min with ONE SONG, an extremely slow countdown of frames, for the same CD which EAC ripped in 10 min???

[mville]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

strange, it happens also with cd with absolute no scratch and which EAC rips in much lesser time and with no errors and verified accurate rip

Have you configured CDRipper with accuraterip?

[Spoon]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Disable c2 pointers if you have them enabled.

[Gio-Gio]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Define "configured". I have gone through the initial setup, option per option, and done all the tests and "detect" and things I could find.
Accurate is selected now.
I attach three screens.
Tell me please if I should do other tests.
As I have edited above just before you wrote, 27min and it was just the half of the countdown? One single song? vs 10min complete CD with accurate rip in EAC?
There MUST be something wrong.

You can see in the last screen I think, that I have the 8k option active, because I use my sata dvd drive in an external case with usb cable. I have a notebook where I have installed a second HDD where the dvd was.
Anyway, this does not create any problem in EAC. And, with 8k option disabled the result in dB is the same.
I could go through the hassle of opening the notebook again (dell, can be done) and put the dvd back in place and see if the rips are faster, although then I will have the HDD (where I am storing the rips) external in usb, so, no idea what is better...

[Gio-Gio]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Disable c2 pointers if you have them enabled.

If I disable them, I will not have a secure rip anymore, right?

I forgot the screens:


Just to be clear, my drive supports C2.
And in EAC I also have accurate rip, secure, and c2 all active.
I hope I can solve this (without sacrificing c2 and secure ripping!) because I was happy that dB was ripping some CDs in 1/4 the time than EAC.

[mville]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Have you had any Acccuraterips in CDRipper for any CDs?

Also, some drives don't implement C2 Error Pointers correctly, even though the firmware claims to support the feature. Try to rip with C2 Error Pointers disabled.

... something to read: dBpoweramp CD Ripper

[Gio-Gio]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Yes, all what I have ripped (in eac or dB) which was non scratched gave accurate rips with good confidence generally below 10.
And about c2, eac had no problems with c2 active, I do not see why should dB.
How can I know how accurate is the c2 of my drive?

Anyway, yes, deactivating c2 all is good, but, hey, it only relies on accurate rips database to tell me it is ok, and with a confidence of 200!!! Or of 20 with pressing offset -664.
I do not feel comfortable with this.
I want C2. This is going to be my only rip before I sell or give all my CDs.
I do not want any fanatic paranoid accurate ripping, but I want a secure one.
I do not feel secure with only relying on AR database.
But correct me if I am wrong.

Thanks for the link, I had read the help file but not seen that one.

Do you think it may be that dB did not detect my device correctly?
I really cannot imagine why should it make a 22000+ frames countdown of one hour for one song which EAC rips in 3 minutes, and we all know that EAC is quite paranoid with errors. I had to set its error recovery option to low. I have now tested the same song once again with EAC and changed the recovery option to high, and it ripped the song in 1 minute 20 seconds.
I think dB is doing something very wrong there.

[mville]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Yes, all what I have ripped (in eac or dB) which was non scratched gave accurate rips with good confidence generally below 10.
And about c2, eac had no problems with c2 active, I do not see why should dB

How are you sure EAC had no problems with C2 Error Pointers?

How can I know how accurate is the c2 of my drive?

I don't know, but if CDRipper works without it, I'm pretty sure your drive doesn't implement C2 Error Pointers correctly. Spoon may be able to provide a more definitive answer.

Anyway, yes, deactivating c2 all is good, but, hey, it only relies on accurate rips database to tell me it is ok, and with a confidence of 200!!! Or of 20 with pressing offset -664.
I do not feel comfortable with this.
I want C2. This is going to be my only rip before I sell or give all my CDs.
I do not want any fanatic paranoid accurate ripping, but I want a secure one.
I do not feel secure with only relying on AR database.
But correct me if I am wrong.

Wrong, read both Secure Ripping and Secure and Advanced Options sections found here: dBpoweramp CD Ripper

[garym]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

If you get an ACCURATERIP match of greater than 1 (in case you are matching your own prior rip of same CD) then you can't do any better than this. An AR of 200 is no better than AR of 2 for all practical purposes. The odds of having the SAME data from a CD with even one other person who ripped a *different* copy of the CD on a *different* machine and to have your rip NOT be bit perfect is astronomical. About the same odds as me waking up tomorrow and finding out that I've been named both King of England and President of the United States.

Bottom line: AR match of 2 (or even 1 if you've never ripped the CD) means you have a bit perfect rip. And how you got the match doesn't matter (C2 or not, rereads or not, etc.)

[Gio-Gio]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

Ok, I have installed the dvd again inside the notebook, after all in this moment I am ripping a lot and it makes sense to have a better performance on the dvd than on the HDD.
And I have done all the detecting on dB again.
With surprise some results were now different. Which shows that the same drive does not perform the same when directly internal in sata or external in usb.
And it is not only a matter of amount of data.
For example, take the screen 2 a few posts above. There was no detected cache, and the FUA had been detected and was active.
Now a 75kb cache was detected and no FUA.
C2 was once again detected though.
I have done that same CD and there was no frames countdown now.
So, problem solved.

Now, a quick mea culpa, I thought that accurate 1 was better than 200. Like, first place...
So I thought that a result of accurate 200 was very inaccurate and I could not rely only on it.

About C2, if Spoon knows how I can find out how good it really is my drive in c2, I would like to test.
How can I know that EAC had no problems? Because it did what it was expected: with a scratched CD it was very slow (particularly if in high error recovery mode) and gave of course no accurate rip result. With a good CD it was fast, there was no error, and the tracks were verified as accurate.
With that same good CD dB found errors and made the frames countdown. Now we know it was some problem caused by the fact that the drive was in an external case, via USB (and we still should understand why dB had this problem and EAC did not. Maybe dB should improve the way it detects drives?). But before finding this out, we could have safely supposed that the problem was in dB, not in EAC, because there cannot be errors in tracks verified as accurate. So, dB was seeing ghosts.

Anyway, thanks you all and let me know if there is a way to test the accuracy of my drive's c2. I am curious now.

I understand what you mean about the accurate rip database, but I have many CDs which are not found in that database. Or at least I think that when a track is ripped 100% ok with no errors but could not be verified as accurate, it means it was not in the database, right?

Cheers

[garym]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

I understand what you mean about the accurate rip database, but I have many CDs which are not found in that database. Or at least I think that when a track is ripped 100% ok with no errors but could not be verified as accurate, it means it was not in the database, right?

Cheers

correct. you get a SECURE rip not AR verified because the CD is not in AR database. I have many CDs like that too that are not in AR database. By the way, sometimes brand new CDs are not in AR database yet at the time you rip. But you can later check these for AR match by using the dbpa related tool, PERFECTTUNES. A very useful tool.

p.s. you'll never see AR matches of > 200 by the way because 200 is the most the AR software will report even if there are 50,000 matches, which is easily possible on popular CDs.

[garym]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

and keep in mind that the same drive can work very differently when directly connected inside a computer vs connected via USB or fireware in an external case, particularly in regard to C2 errors.

[turntable97]

Re: re-rip and frames countdown. What is that?

and keep in mind that the same drive can work very differently when directly connected inside a computer vs connected via USB or fireware in an external case, particularly in regard to C2 errors.

That's exactly what I realised:

I've never had any problem ripping CDs. But since a few weeks i get about 10000 frame errors per audio track (Re-Rip Frames 10000...) and "inaccurate" results.
I thought it's a defective drive but after I changed it, I got the same errors.

I have an internal Pioneer drive connected via SATA.
As soon as I used an external SATA-to-USB-Adapter, and i connected the drive via USB, the ripping results were excellent again.

So what is going on with SATA? Is there a BIOS setting which needs to be set?
Or another windows driver?

Please help! I'd like to use my Pioneer drive in a normal, internal way again.

Thanks!!