How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

[schmidj]

Question on how TuneFusion knows what file to update? Windows 10

My library has "albums" stored with a folder for each album which contains files for all the tracks in the albums. I screwed up and forgot to (re)number the tracks on a large "album" of downloads before placing it in the directory which TuneFusion is set to automatically convert to m4a files for my car. By now they have automatically been converted. I corrected my oversight this evening on the (FLAC) master files. Since this correction only involved changing the contents of the "track" tag and not the filename, and since I don't think the software I used for the correction (mp3tag's auto track numbering function) changes the last modified date of the files, am I correct that TuneFusion, running to only detect changes, will not rewrite the incorrect m4a files? If that is so, if I manually change the last modified date of the album folder but not the hundreds of individual track files in the folder, will TuneFusion update each of the files? Or do I have to run it in the "next sync refresh all" mode which should work but will be a slow process as my library has about 130,000 songs. Or is there a better way?

[Spoon]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

A normal sync should remove orphaned files, and put new ones?

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Normal sync works fine on new/removed files. I've never specifically checked on "orphaned" files, I assume you mean the case where the folder they are in has had its filename changed?? If I delete the folder, Windows deletes any folders in it and TuneFusion also removes the deleted folder and any files in it (that it originally synced) from the synced directory. It didn't (I haven't tested this recently) remove such folders when there were non-audio files such as folder.jpg or the text ripping log in the folder. (but that is not my issue at present). It only removed the audio files, but left the parent folder and the folder.jpg and text files undeleted in that case.

Based on a little experimenting, and from what I recall from earlier, if I change the metadata in an audio file using dBpa or mp3tag, those programs don't change the datestamp for the file (there may be an option to do so, I need to look). And in those cases the files in the copy that TuneFusion is syncing never gets updated with the new metadada. (The datestamp isn't changed and the changed metadata doesn't change the length of the file because it is written in otherwise unoccupied space in the tags.)

If this is true, a thought?? If the sync program (in this case TuneFusion) did a checksum of the entire file (including the metadata tags) and saved that in its indexing data, and then recalculated the checksums looking for differences when resyncing, it would find the files with changed metadata (or anything else) and could resync them. Possibly too computationally intensive and slow to do as a "normal" resync, but I'd assume a lot faster than my about 24 hour "refresh all". In that case possibly an option between "normal" and "resync all"??? Or there may now be a better way I missed.

In this case, I ended up using "Next Sync Refresh All, which appears that it is working, but it is only 50% done (after 12 hours, and still running) with syncing my almost 130,000 song FLAC (and a few mp3 and m4a) collection to the m4a copy I eventually put on the SD card in my phone. I gather there is no way of finding only the files with updated metadata but unchanged datestamps and resyncing just those (a few hundred out of the 130,000). Is that true, or is there a better way?

Thanks

John

[Spoon]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

I might have confused with the option to 'Detect and resync missing files' option.

Will make a note of this to look at in the future.

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Thanks, Spoon

[mville]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Based on a little experimenting, and from what I recall from earlier, if I change the metadata in an audio file using dBpa or mp3tag, those programs don't change the datestamp for the file (there may be an option to do so, I need to look). And in those cases the files in the copy that TuneFusion is syncing never gets updated with the new metadada. (The datestamp isn't changed and the changed metadata doesn't change the length of the file because it is written in otherwise unoccupied space in the tags.)

1. MP3Tag has the (enable/disable) option: Preserve file modification time when saving tags
2. dBpoweramp ReplayGain utility has the (enable/disable) option: Preserve Date Modified File Time

Based on this thread: TuneFUSION > Syncing criteria, when editing my master library tags, I have to disable options 1/2, otherwise TuneFUSION will not sync the edited files.

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Thanks Mville, you saved me from some further experimentation. I'll have to set mp3tag to change the file date/time (which I gather is disabling the modification time preservation, a interesting exercise in semantics...

My tag updates typically are not replay gain but corrections, often of typos or lack of consistancy, in one or more of the tag entries. Even when the corrected tag would have, under my file naming system, changed the file name, I usually don't make the corresponding change in the file name (or parent folder name) unless that change would drastically relocate the (alphabetically) sorted file, as I only use the file/folder names to manually locate the file or folder, such as to make further tag corrections or delete the entry.

Without having looked at the option for the right click dBpa tag editor (or the similar Perfectunes editor) myself, I gather from your post that there is no option to force a file date stamp update when updating tags. I suppose I should investigate the options myself though.

I typically use mp3tag when having to update the entries when there are numerous changes or they involve multiple parent folders, but the right click dBpa editor when fixing typos on a single album or file. The mp3tag editor has so many time-saving aids, but the dBpa editor is even quicker for simple fixes.

[mville]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Without having looked at the option for the right click dBpa tag editor (or the similar Perfectunes editor) myself, I gather from your post that there is no option to force a file date stamp update when updating tags. I suppose I should investigate the options myself though.

I'm using dBpoweramp Reference R17.7 and I can't find any options related to the right-click Edit ID Tags and Modification Date/Time.

I typically use mp3tag when having to update the entries when there are numerous changes or they involve multiple parent folders, but the right click dBpa editor when fixing typos on a single album or file. The mp3tag editor has so many time-saving aids, but the dBpa editor is even quicker for simple fixes.

Apart from the dBpoweramp utility codecs, I edit tags in MP3Tag.

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Hi, I looked through the current updated version of dBpoweramp Reference (which I found I hadn't updated on this laptop, but was current on the desktop I do 90 percent of my audio editing/CD ripping on). I couldn't find any right click date/time options.

However there is such an option in the PerfectTUNES options (tool symbol at the top right of the entry screen). The default is unchecked, which I gather forces an update of the date/time when editing metadata tags. The wording of the option to me is unclear as to which one forces the update of the date/time, does "preserve" mean it preserves the old date/time before the tags were updated or preserves the new current date/time generated by updating the file with the new/corrected tags. Possibly I'm just getting dense with old age, but I'd like clarification. Yes, I can run an experiment, but I'd prefer to have this clarified somewhere. And does this option operate with both the main screen tag editor and the right click PerfectTUNES editor, or only the main screen editor?

So, and I realize I'm not in the feature request part of the forum, but I hope that doesn't matter, I'd like to request an option in dBpoweramp tag editing to have the right click editor either change the date/time or leave it unchanged (wording clearer than preserve to me anyway) when changing a tag.

[mville]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

schmidj, I read Preserve Date/Time as DO NOT change the file date/time, even though the file has been modified.

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Mville, without a test, I think you are correct, but it could easily be misinterpreted. Labeling the checkbox something like "update file date/time when tags are changed", with a reverse of the checkbox action and default condition would, to me, be much clearer.

Thanks

John

[vilsen]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

"Preserve" file modification time is pretty much a standard expression, long time used in e.g. foobar, dBpoweramp, Mp3tag and Picard.

Normally, the modification time is updated when the file is modified. If you want to hinder that from happening, some programs give you the option to preserve the modification time. Think of it like that and it makes perfect sense.

[mville]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

"Preserve" file modification time is pretty much a standard expression, long time used in e.g. foobar, dBpoweramp, Mp3tag and Picard.

Totally agree, but if one has an alive mind, this phrase, as with many English phrases can be ambiguous. IMO, if unsure, it is smarter to confirm rather than assume, as demonstrated perfectly here by schmidj.

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

There is most definitely a problem with TuneFusion syncing files with changed tags (and changed "date modified" file datestamp), unless I'm doing something really stupid.

I just ran a little test. Modified three mp3 files (out of my ~ 130,000 collection) in mp3tag by adding a couple of dashes in the comments tag. The checkbox for preserving the date is unchecked, and looking at the files in windows explorer, the modified date was in fact changed to today. Then I started the sync to the folder which holds the m3a files manually. The source files are on one of my NAS servers, on a drive mapped on the PC running TuneFusion, the destination sync is on a drive on the PC running TuneFusion. After running for an hour and reporting the sync was completed, I looked at the detailed log. The three files were not updated.

I know the sync actually ran, because there were about a dozen files I had deleted (because they were duplicates) in the source directory, and they were, as they should be, deleted from the destination sync directory.

The options on TuneFusion: General & Music library - options none selected, which obviously defaults to Next Sync Detect and rewrite missing files on destination
Advance Sync Options, Rewrite ID tags ticked, Delete Destination Tracks No Longer Present ticked, and On Sync Check File Size checked.
Audio Formats, copy 1 to 1 none ticked, reencode lossy set to m4afdk, quality VBR, one tick down from highest quality, reencode lossless no lossless, use lossy encoder, the only DSP is replay gain.

Source filtering, all audio types ticked. no other filtering.

I subsequently noticed there is a source filtering date tab. Set to the default "date not checked, all files included" So as a test, I've selected 365 days (the longest period in the dropdown list. I started it almost an hour ago, it is still indexing, the number of files indexed is currently approaching 200,000 (many more files than I have on the source drive). We'll see what that does.

But something is wrong here, in the default mode it is not seeing modified dates that have been changed.

[schmidj]

Re: How does TuneFusion know what files in a previously sync'd folder need a rewrite

Well, that sure as heck didn't work. After indexing for over an hour and 1/2, with the files indexed total somewhat more than twice the number of files I have, it reported 11 files needed resyncing. When I saw nothing visibly happening, I opened the detailed log, which said the library contained some 3400 odd files and 11 required resyncing and then started rapidly deleting most of the files on the synced directory. I killed the sync at that point, but now I've got to run another sync to replace all the files that one deleted. What it apparently did was to attempt to delete any files older than the 365 days I had selected in the date tab. What the 11 files that it said required resyncing, I never found out...

So all is not well in TuneFusion land unless I'm really missing something obvious...

Any ideas??