Files Not in iTunes Library

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

No problem at all, Roger. I'm anxious to see you get this issue resolved, too. I know how frustrating it can be when something just isn't working the way you expect and there's no obvious reason why.

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As a side note, there is a good side benefit to all of this trouble. Over years of battling iTunes' quirks, especially when it came to moving its library around (different drives, new computers, etc), I realized that the set-up you're doing is the "best practice" approach. Especially since you're using an external drive. When you use that "Create" option to set up a new library, it's essentially a self-contained, portable library that's much easier to move when the time comes. Just changing the location in Preferences > Advanced doesn't do that. So, should you want/need to move the library in the future, say to a new computer, you can just attach the external drive and use Option+iTunes to select that existing library, if you want. This is much more efficient than moving all your music into a brand new library and starting over again.

Thks for the heads up, good to keep in mind.

[BrodyBoy]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

Thanks for all your help.

Roger

No problem at all, Roger. I'm anxious to see you get this issue resolved, too. I know how frustrating it can be when something just isn't working the way you expect and there's no obvious reason why.

------

As a side note, there is a good side benefit to all of this trouble. Over years of battling iTunes' quirks, especially when it came to moving its library around (different drives, new computers, etc), I realized that the set-up you're doing is the "best practice" approach. Especially since you're using an external drive. When you use that "Create" option to set up a new library, it's essentially a self-contained, portable library that's much easier to move when the time comes. Just changing the location in Preferences > Advanced doesn't do that. So, should you want/need to move the library in the future, say to a new computer, you can just attach the external drive and use Option+iTunes to select that existing library, if you want. This is much more efficient than moving all your music into a brand new library and starting over again.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

Thanks for all your help.

Roger

[BrodyBoy]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

BrodyBoy,

I found out I can drag/drop the files from Finder so think I prefer to trying a reinstall. Although it may not be the ideal solution do you see any significant problems with this ?

Roger

No, I don't think so. When I've read up on this stuff on the past, I've seen varying kinds of explanations of exactly how this works on Macs, so I don't know the definitive answer. In Windows, of course, you can't just delete an application to uninstall it (as there are a number of registry changes and other files involved). But Macs have that whole "opacity" thing going on, making it annoyingly hard to know what's going on under the hood.

Overall, my impression is that it actually involves some low-level terminal commands to truly uninstall native OSX applications, but that a new installation does a good job of "installing over" the old app. I cannot personally confirm this, but I suspect you're safe either way.

The bottom line is that you're fixing any possible issues with the application itself, and then doing a proper library set-up on the external drive.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

BrodyBoy,

I found out I can drag/drop the files from Finder so think I prefer to trying a reinstall. Although it may not be the ideal solution do you see any significant problems with this ?

Roger

[BrodyBoy]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

I assume my current iTunes should be removed first ? And if I don't find all the iTunes files stuff is that a problem ?

It's not a problem if you don't find iTunes files there....it's just better not to have remnants of old installations, so I was suggesting you check for & get rid of them.

Ideally, yes, it would be preferable if you could remove your current iTunes installation first. In the Windows universe, that's easy. But as I understand it, it's actually hard to do on a Mac. If you think you can, go for it.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

Oh okay. Yes, like I said, I do think it's basically an iTunes configuration issue. But these other players integrate with iTunes, and may alter its settings.



Personally, if it were me, I'd re-install both iTunes and Amarra on the Mac Mini, if that's not too much of a pain (with activations, licenses, etc). But just focusing on iTunes, here's how you would completely re-install it and re-build its music library. (Note that this may delete all your iTunes playlists and user settings.)

• Download and re-install a fresh copy of iTunes. (Make sure those 3rd party players are not running while you do, if you didn't uninstall them.) Don't let iTunes scan for music at the end of the install. Close iTunes.
• Move all your music into one big folder on the external drive (this isn't absolutely required, but it makes the next part easier). Delete any iTunes-looking files or folders, including the "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder (move any music out first). So basically, you just want all your music, nothing else, on one big folder on the external drive. No iTunes stuff.
• Hold down the OPTION key while you open iTunes.....this opens a dialog box to Create or Change your iTunes library. Select Create.
• In the "New iTunes Library" dialog box: For "Save as," give it a name, if desired. In the "Where" window, select the root directory of your external drive (not that big music folder).
• In Finder, go to your external drive and drag that big music folder into the "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder.
• Open iTunes and let it re-build your library.

Before adding any of the 3rd party stuff, you may want to test that the fresh install works as expected. Copy some new music into the "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder (or rip from the PC). Next time you open iTunes, it should find that music.

I assume my current iTunes should be removed first ? And if I don't find all the iTunes files stuff is that a problem ?

[BrodyBoy]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

Bad explanation by me, I mean the new rips are missing so no play these rips just using iTunes, ie with the other players closed.

Oh okay. Yes, like I said, I do think it's basically an iTunes configuration issue. But these other players integrate with iTunes, and may alter its settings.

Personally, if it were me, I'd re-install both iTunes and Amarra on the Mac Mini, if that's not too much of a pain (with activations, licenses, etc). But just focusing on iTunes, here's how you would completely re-install it and re-build its music library. (Note that this may delete all your iTunes playlists and user settings.)

• Download and re-install a fresh copy of iTunes. (Make sure those 3rd party players are not running while you do, if you didn't uninstall them.) Don't let iTunes scan for music at the end of the install. Close iTunes.
• Move all your music into one big folder on the external drive (this isn't absolutely required, but it makes the next part easier). Delete any iTunes-looking files or folders, including the "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder (move any music out first). So basically, you just want all your music, nothing else, on one big folder on the external drive. No iTunes stuff.
• Hold down the OPTION key while you open iTunes.....this opens a dialog box to Create or Change your iTunes library. Select Create.
• In the "New iTunes Library" dialog box: For "Save as," give it a name, if desired. In the "Where" window, select the root directory of your external drive (not that big music folder).
• In Finder, go to your external drive and drag that big music folder into the "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder.
• Open iTunes and let it re-build your library.

Before adding any of the 3rd party stuff, you may want to test that the fresh install works as expected. Copy some new music into the "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder (or rip from the PC). Next time you open iTunes, it should find that music.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

iTunes can't play your music? What happens.....an error message?

Bad explanation by me, I mean the new rips are missing so no play these rips just using iTunes, ie with the other players closed.

[BrodyBoy]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

iTunes can't play your music? What happens.....an error message?

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

I understand the desperation. (I actually get that way a lot when I try to navigate the Mac universe! I hate how it tries to make things "easier" by being so opaque.) But I honestly don't think this is a dBp issue....I believe it's the iTunes-Amarra-Pure Music configuration on your Mac Mini. All dBp can do is send the rips to wherever you tell it to....it has no control over what iTunes does or doesn't do with them after that.

I'm aware of the technical knocks on iTunes as a player, and therefore the desire for higher-quality options. But I think some combination of iTunes updates (which are sometimes known to render previous-version features non-functional), and/or your Amarra and Pure Music configurations has altered the library set-up on the Mac Mini. There's nothing you can do in dBp, particularly since you're using it on a completely different computer, that will identify or fix iTunes library issues over on the Mac.

I suggest you simplify your set-up. Choose one of those players and uninstall/de-activate the other one, and do a clean library set-up in iTunes. In other words, start with the basics, fixing from the bottom up: Those players integrate with iTunes (and may well change its settings and therefore confound each other), so get the iTunes configuration right first. Then move on to the player of your choice, re-installing if necessary, and get it set up correctly. Only then can you really know where you need send new music from the Windows computer.

Since I cannot play iTunes as a stand alone player would that not suggest it is not associated with any of these players and just an iTunes issue ?

How would I do a clean library set up ? not sure what you mean.

I normally have just one player open, Amarra of late, you mean start by uninstalling all but Amarra ?

[BrodyBoy]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

I am reluctant to report results as you have put so much time helping, but it is still not fixed. Seems all went well through deleting the old Add to and creating a new one, and it did the scan, but having tried several albums they just are not in iTunes, only in Finder. I tried both ripping to the Add to folder and just my Mach2 HHD folder, which is the dBPA config when I did first time set up years ago. Alas this is frustrating.

Out of desperation I think I will try reinstalling dBPA knowing it is not likely going help. And the NAS continues to rip ok btw. If you wish to throw in the towel I surely will understand.

I understand the desperation. (I actually get that way a lot when I try to navigate the Mac universe! I hate how it tries to make things "easier" by being so opaque.) But I honestly don't think this is a dBp issue....I believe it's the iTunes-Amarra-Pure Music configuration on your Mac Mini. All dBp can do is send the rips to wherever you tell it to....it has no control over what iTunes does or doesn't do with them after that.

I'm aware of the technical knocks on iTunes as a player, and therefore the desire for higher-quality options. But I think some combination of iTunes updates (which are sometimes known to render previous-version features non-functional), and/or your Amarra and Pure Music configurations has altered the library set-up on the Mac Mini. There's nothing you can do in dBp, particularly since you're using it on a completely different computer, that will identify or fix iTunes library issues over on the Mac.

I suggest you simplify your set-up. Choose one of those players and uninstall/de-activate the other one, and do a clean library set-up in iTunes. In other words, start with the basics, fixing from the bottom up: Those players integrate with iTunes (and may well change its settings and therefore confound each other), so get the iTunes configuration right first. Then move on to the player of your choice, re-installing if necessary, and get it set up correctly. Only then can you really know where you need send new music from the Windows computer.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

Okay, this was really bugging me! So I pulled out my dual-boot Mac, booted into "the Mac side" (which I hardly ever do), attached an external drive, and played with iTunes to figure out exactly where it puts everything (in the Mac universe). I think I've got a grip on it!

The "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder on the external drive must be corrupted....as that is indeed the one you should be using. (The original one on your Mac Mini system drive doesn't work when your iTunes library is set elsewhere.) How that happened is hard to say, but it's pretty easy to re-establish it. You need to do that first, then try again to send your AIFF rips to the folder. Here's how:

• On the Mac Mini, navigate to the external drive where you music is, and drag that "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder into the trash. Yup...get rid of it completely.
• Open iTunes (on the Mac Mini)
• Go to Preferences > Advanced
• Uncheck to box to "Keep iTunes Media folder organized"
• Close the Preferences dialog box, then re-open it
• Check the box to "Keep iTunes Media folder organized"
• Close the Preferences dialog box.

iTunes will re-scan the music library, which can take awhile depending on how big it is. It will also create a new "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder. Try a dBp rip again (sending the AIFFs to the new folder). Finally, go open iTunes on the Mac Mini. The new music should be there this time.

I am reluctant to report results as you have put so much time helping, but it is still not fixed. Seems all went well through deleting the old Add to and creating a new one, and it did the scan, but having tried several albums they just are not in iTunes, only in Finder. I tried both ripping to the Add to folder and just my Mach2 HHD folder, which is the dBPA config when I did first time set up years ago. Alas this is frustrating.

Out of desperation I think I will try reinstalling dBPA knowing it is not likely going help. And the NAS continues to rip ok btw. If you wish to throw in the towel I surely will understand.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

Okay, this was really bugging me! So I pulled out my dual-boot Mac, booted into "the Mac side" (which I hardly ever do), attached an external drive, and played with iTunes to figure out exactly where it puts everything (in the Mac universe). I think I've got a grip on it!

The "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder on the external drive must be corrupted....as that is indeed the one you should be using. (The original one on your Mac Mini system drive doesn't work when your iTunes library is set elsewhere.) How that happened is hard to say, but it's pretty easy to re-establish it. You need to do that first, then try again to send your AIFF rips to the folder. Here's how:

• On the Mac Mini, navigate to the external drive where you music is, and drag that "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder into the trash. Yup...get rid of it completely.
• Open iTunes (on the Mac Mini)
• Go to Preferences > Advanced
• Uncheck to box to "Keep iTunes Media folder organized"
• Close the Preferences dialog box, then re-open it
• Check the box to "Keep iTunes Media folder organized"
• Close the Preferences dialog box.

iTunes will re-scan the music library, which can take awhile depending on how big it is. It will also create a new "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder. Try a dBp rip again (sending the AIFFs to the new folder). Finally, go open iTunes on the Mac Mini. The new music should be there this time.

I had not seen this post when doing my last obviously, will try this today when time. A corrupted Auto Add makes sense.

If I recall though the 'keep iTunes Media Folder Organized' is already unchecked because it's part of Pure Music set up, forget why. But let me confirm first.

[rogerdn]

Re: Files Not in iTunes Library

That's because iTunes will always save its own rips to its own library. Unlike the issue with dBp, where you need to tell it the file destination, iTunes already knows where it is. So I don't think the issue is so much dBp, per se, as it is confusion about where your iTunes library resides, or more specifically, where the functioning "Automatically Add to iTunes" folder is located.

Agree

Regarding your previous post.....remember, iTunes is supposed to grab anything anything it finds in that folder and move it. Hence, successfully added files should not be found there. The fact that files in the folder are not being added suggests it's the wrong "auto" destination. I suspect it's on the Mac Mini's main system drive. If you're willing to keep troubleshooting, I'd suggest you look for that folder.

I understand your analysis but am not friendly enough with Macs to know what in 'the wrong "auto" destination. I suspect it's on the Mac Mini's main system drive' means or how to look for that folder.

Reinstalling dBp won't automatically fix this path/location problem. DBp only saves the files to the location you specify.....aside from letting it save to the default "My Music" location on the Windows computer it's installed on, it cannot make any determination about other network locations.

I would not hold out much hope for reinstalling but sometimes redoing something corrects a set up error.

Thks for the continued help.