Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

[kichu1979]

Hi

I would like to mention one thing that is told by folks on other threads, however I notice people dont know what is going on. Some people report errors while opening some m4a files... and some other m4a files open just fine.

For the situation is this. All m4a (Apple Lossles) files created via dbpoweramp itunes ALAC pluguin open just fine.

However dbpoweramp can't open apple lossless files created in the latest itunes v7.

All earlier alac itunes 6.5 files are working perfectly (can open, edit tag), while
alac files created in itunes 7 just doesnt work (cant open, cant read tag info).

Anyone else experiencing this ?

Thanks,
Kris

[Deano]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

iTunes 7 does change the tagging structure of the m4a container it uses (to support Album Artist as I recall), which may well be what is breaking the Apple Lossless file support with dBpowerAMP.

[Spoon]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

Will note as a bug to be looked at.

[Ventriloquist]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

Further feedback from another dbpowerAMP user on files altered by iT7:

Last night I tasked dbpowerAMP with converting 1660 lossless (ALE) M4A files to MP3. It failed with "could not be opened" errors on 406 of those files. As an aside, the same error occurs regardless of your target format (decoding to WAV will kick out the same error.)

The files in question were encoded by iTunes at several points in time, and range from the 4.7 era to 7.0.

The unifying factor for all of these tracks is album artwork. The tracks which failed are tracks which I manually added album art to (from sources other than the iTunes store.)

The album artwork in question was added to the files after upgrading to version 7. Removing the artwork does not fix the "could not be opened" error.

All tracks which received art from the iTunes store are unaffected. (The art from the iTunes store is not placed in the files themselves, but in an Album Art folder.) The presence of the "Album Artist" tag does not appear to be the problem. (I took an "unbroken" album, added Album Artist information to it, and converted it via dbpowerAMP with no errors.)

*edit*

OK, weird. Of those 406 unconvertable tracks, all but 7 were complete albums that failed on conversion and have custom artwork. But for some reason, the following tracks from The Beatles - The White Album (1968) managed to convert despite having custom artwork.

1-03 Glass Onion.mp3
1-05 Wild Honey Pie.mp3
1-10 I'm So Tired.mp3
1-11 Black Bird.mp3
1-12 Piggies.mp3
1-15 Why Don't We Do It In The Road.mp3
1-16 I Will.mp3

They were imported at the same time as the the other 23 tracks from The White Album, and I've now added custom art and removed it several times from the whole album. The listed tracks are able to convert despite no apparent difference in their encoding.

*edit edit*

It is worth noting that the 7 files with custom artwork that "slipped through" seem to be some of the smallest files in the album. (7 of the 9 smallest White Album encodes are the ones listed above.)

[Spoon]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

I would guess if iTunes v7 touches the files then they would have the problem that the first poster mentioned.

[Ventriloquist]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

I would guess if iTunes v7 touches the files then they would have the problem that the first poster mentioned.

Seven of the successful album conversions I did were for CDs imported into iTunes after installing version 7, so it may not be that simple (unfortunately.)

I'm just trying to give you more information to hang your hats on.

[Ventriloquist]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

To that end, here's a followup:

Sample album: Elvis Costello - The Very Best Of Elvis Costello

(1) Imported into iTunes 7, direct from CD, format: ALE
(2) Fed to dbpowerAMP, all tracks converted successfully, format: MP3, lame 3.96, etc.
(3) Deleted MP3s from step 2
(4) Added custom artwork to ALE files in iTunes
(5) Fed to dbpowerAMP, all tracks fail to open
(6) Removed custom artwork from ALE files in iTunes
(7) Fed to dbpowerAMP, all tracks fail to open
(8) From within iTunes, convert ALE files to WAV
(9) Delete ALE files
(10) From within iTunes, convert WAV files to ALE
(11) Fed to dbpowerAMP, all tracks converted successfully again
(12) Deleted MP3s from step 11
(13) From within iTunes, add tag info to all unused fields (including Album Artist)
(14) Fed to dbpowerAMP, all tracks converted successfully

So, it isn't a matter of iTunes 7 making any modifications to the files, as "clean" imports in 7 convert successfully. It specifically appears to be embedding artwork.

I'm not saying there can't be other ways in which iT7 can break compatibility with dbpowerAMP, I'm just saying I can reproduce this consistently, now.

And for the time being, I'm just taking all the "flawed" ALE files, converting them to WAV, converting them back, and then feeding them to dbpowerAMP. So a (laborious) workaround exists.

[Spoon]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

Is it just art work you have added manually? or iTunes own sourced artwork (from the internet)?

[Ventriloquist]

Re: Apple Lossless & iTunes problem

Is it just art work you have added manually? or iTunes own sourced artwork (from the internet)?

Albums which have artwork from the iTunes store do not appear to be adversely affected. 1254 of my files converted successfully on the first attempt with no adjustments / workarounds required. All 1254 had associated* covers from iTS.

* Artwork supplied by iTS is not embedded in the files, but is instead stored in "x:\Documents & Settings\User\My Documents\My Music\iTunes\Album Artwork\"

The 406 which failed are albums which I had to supply artwork for due to the lack of availability via iTS. (The Beatles, Led Zeppelin, various classical recordings, etc.) Artwork supplied from non-iTS sources is not converted into *.itc files for storage in Album Artwork, but is appended to the audio files.

*edited for clarity on a few points*