Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

[garym]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

OK, I think I understand! Please correct me if any of this is incorrect:

1. If I don't apply any replay gain settings, all tracks will always be played back at the levels they were originally recorded. This is fine if listening to individual albums, but may result in some tracks being much quieter or louder than others when shuffled with tracks from other albums (either individually or as whole albums).

2. Applying "Track Gain" solves this problem by levelling out the volume of all individual tracks. However, this will also result in deliberately quiet tracks being played back at the same volume as everything else.

3. Applying "Track & Album Gain" works in the same way as "Track Gain", but if complete albums are played back-to-back (i.e. individual tracks are not shuffled between albums), each album will be recognised as a whole and played back with all the tracks within that album at the original levels relative to one another (i.e. quiet tracks will remain quiet, loud ones loud). Albums are levelled as a whole, relative to one another.

4. Thus, listening to whole albums with "Track & Album" gain applied should basically sound identical to listening with no replay gain applied at all. Only the overall levels of the albums are matched. However, if tracks are shuffled between albums, they are then levelled out individually in the same way as with "Track Gain".

5. None of these replay gain settings come into play unless the settings in the music player are selected to do so.

I hope that all makes sense, I don't think there's a simple way to explain any of this!

Yes, you have the gist of this correct. I would quibble with your use of the word "applying". What you really mean is "using", that is "using Track gain". When we talk of "applying ReplayGain" we are typically talking about another DSP -- ReplayGainApply. This is not just a tag, it actually takes the RG value and PERMANENTLY CHANGES the volume of underlying audio. But that's not what you are doing. Other than that quibble, you're summary is correct.

Of course the most important part is No. 5. Your music server/player must be capable of USING the RG values. And even if it is, it doesn't mean it can do the automatic "smart" use of ALBUM vs TRACK. For example, iTunes doesn't use RG values at all and even it's substitute, SOUNDCHECK, is TRACK based volume adjustment, unless you use dbpa to artificially make it use ALBUM values.

[Supernaut]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

In case of a Multi Disk, I would like to safe the full album in one folder, but of course differentiating between the different disks, e.g. Disk 1 -Title 1, Disk 1- Title 2, (...), Disk 2 - Title 1, Disk 2 - Title 2 and so on.

You may be interested in this thread dealing with the same topic:
Custom Naming

[Supernaut]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Album replay gain allows the tracks on the same album to retain the intra-album relative volume (dynamics). Using track gain when playing the album would modify this.

OK, I think I understand! Please correct me if any of this is incorrect:

1. If I don't apply any replay gain settings, all tracks will always be played back at the levels they were originally recorded. This is fine if listening to individual albums, but may result in some tracks being much quieter or louder than others when shuffled with tracks from other albums (either individually or as whole albums).

2. Applying "Track Gain" solves this problem by levelling out the volume of all individual tracks. However, this will also result in deliberately quiet tracks being played back at the same volume as everything else.

3. Applying "Track & Album Gain" works in the same way as "Track Gain", but if complete albums are played back-to-back (i.e. individual tracks are not shuffled between albums), each album will be recognised as a whole and played back with all the tracks within that album at the original levels relative to one another (i.e. quiet tracks will remain quiet, loud ones loud). Albums are levelled as a whole, relative to one another.

4. Thus, listening to whole albums with "Track & Album" gain applied should basically sound identical to listening with no replay gain applied at all. Only the overall levels of the albums are matched. However, if tracks are shuffled between albums, they are then levelled out individually in the same way as with "Track Gain".

5. None of these replay gain settings come into play unless the settings in the music player are selected to do so.

I hope that all makes sense, I don't think there's a simple way to explain any of this!

[garym]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Great, thank you so much, it works!

[Apple-Fan]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Great, thank you so much, it works!

[garym]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Sorry Garym,

another question regarding your recommendation for file name settings:

In case of a Multi Disk, I would like to safe the full album in one folder, but of course differentiating between the different disks, e.g. Disk 1 -Title 1, Disk 1- Title 2, (...), Disk 2 - Title 1, Disk 2 - Title 2 and so on.
As far as I understood, you prefer to have each disk of a multi-disk album in a separated folder, right?
Then, can you please help me, what I would need to change in your version to get my preferred version done (for a mac)?

Thank you,
Christian

Try this:

[MAXLENGTH]240,[IFCOMP]Compilations/[album]/[IFMULTI]/[disc].[][track] - [title] - [artist][][IF!COMP][IFVALUE]album artist,[album artist],[artist][]/[album]/[IFMULTI]/[disc].[][track] - [title][][]

[Apple-Fan]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Sorry Garym,

another question regarding your recommendation for file name settings:

In case of a Multi Disk, I would like to safe the full album in one folder, but of course differentiating between the different disks, e.g. Disk 1 -Title 1, Disk 1- Title 2, (...), Disk 2 - Title 1, Disk 2 - Title 2 and so on.
As far as I understood, you prefer to have each disk of a multi-disk album in a separated folder, right?
Then, can you please help me, what I would need to change in your version to get my preferred version done (for a mac)?

Thank you,
Christian

[Apple-Fan]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Dear Garym,

many thanks for your support here as regards the dynamic naming settings: I would like to use yours but for a Mac, so would this make the trick (I saw your comment regarding front slashes)

[MAXLENGTH]240,[IFCOMP]Compilations/[album][IFMULTI]/Disc [disc][]/[track] - [title] - [artist][][IF!COMP][IFVALUE]album artist,[album artist],[artist][]/[album][IFMULTI]\Disc [disc][]/[track] - [title][][]

Thanks for a check!

[garym]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

When I go into DSP settings, the default I get is "Track Gain". Is there any reason to change from this to "Track & Album"? I mean, if the tracks already have adjustment values calculated individually, what's the benefit of applying replaygain to the whole album?

Album replay gain allows the tracks on the same album to retain the intra-album relative volume (dynamics). Using track gain when playing the album would modify this. For example, perhaps an album has a very quiet song/movement followed by a loud song. If you playback using TRACK replaygain, then both songs will sound equally loud/quiet, when they were not meant to by the makers of the album. Some players (all that I use**) are smart about this, and if playing songs from the same album, they automatically use the ALBUM RG value. But if playing a mixture of tracks from different albums will automatically use TRACK RG values. In the old days, TRACK RG was referred to as "RADIO" RG. Because in this case, as in broadcast radio, every song has an approximately equal loudness. And if your player doesn't happen to have such a "smart mode" then it won't hurt to have the ALBUM RG value saved in the tags along with the TRACK RG value. And note that if you are using iTunes/Apple playback, it doesn't use RG values at all. It uses "Soundcheck" called "iTunNorm" or something like that. Note that in dbpa ReplayGain DSP options, you can also add this value. And because iTunes only uses a single volume adjustment value, dbpa allows you to make the iTunNorm value based on *either* ALBUM or TRACK RG values. I personally use an iTunNorm based on ALUBM RG in my own use case when I create mp3 files for use on my iPhone.

Make sense?

**In LMS music server/players this is called "Smart Gain" mode.In foobar2000 this is called "by playback order" mode. In Roon it is called "Auto" mode. Here's a good summary from Roon website:

Roon supports four Volume Leveling modes:

1. Off - disable volume leveling for this zone.
2. Track - Performs adjustments on a track-by-track basis. This produces the most consistent volume level during a playback session, but may result in unpleasant jumps in volume during playback of a gapless album.
3. Album - Performs adjustments on an album-by-album basis. This means that the entirety of an album plays back with the same adjustment, and there are no perceived volume jumps at track boundaries.
4. Auto - Uses track adjustments when playing adjacent tracks from different albums, and album level adjustments when playing adjacent tracks from the same album.

[Supernaut]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

The only DSP I use in ripping is REPLAYGAIN. I use the default values for TRACK & ALBUM. This is just a couple of tags, it does NOT modify the audio. It just provides information for music servers/players that are replaygain aware the info they need to adjust the volume on the fly.

When I go into DSP settings, the default I get is "Track Gain". Is there any reason to change from this to "Track & Album"? I mean, if the tracks already have adjustment values calculated individually, what's the benefit of applying replaygain to the whole album?

[Supernaut]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

here's a thread on how to delete unwanted naming strings. I've never bothered doing it.
https://forum.dbpoweramp.com/showthr...ng-conventions

Brilliant, thank you! I followed the directions on that thread and was able to remove the unwanted naming strings quite easily.

P.S. Not sure why, but on this thread my messages aren't showing up after I submit them. I originally posted this reply yesterday, but it still isn't here. On all the other threads, my messages show up instantly. Anyway, just saying this as it might end up being published twice (as happened with my last reply).

[Supernaut]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

here's a thread on how to delete unwanted naming strings. I've never bothered doing it.
https://forum.dbpoweramp.com/showthr...ng-conventions

Brilliant! Just followed the directions on that thread and was able to delete the unwanted naming strings. Thank you!

[garym]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Ok. that's fine. that's how it is supposed to be. not sure how to delete older strings.

here's a thread on how to delete unwanted naming strings. I've never bothered doing it.

https://forum.dbpoweramp.com/showthread.php?17500-delete-naming-conventions

[garym]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Ok. that's fine. that's how it is supposed to be. not sure how to delete older strings.

[Supernaut]

Re: Need advice before ripping collection to FLAC

Hmmm,both the "MAXLENGTH 240" and the "MAXLENGTH,80, IFVALUE" (if using default) show up in the dynamic naming field settings for me. To be clear, the [MAXLENGTH]240,[IFCOMP] stuff is showing up in the dynamic naming string. It should NOT be showing up as part of your resulting actual file name from ripping.

No, it isn't showing up in the resulting file name, only in the naming field in the bottom left of the screen. It isn't a problem, I just wanted to be sure that's the way it was supposed to be. You can see what I mean here (shows default selected):

To return to default, just under the dynamic naming field settings box, to the far right, is a button for returning to default settings.

Is there a way to clear the Naming field once I've decided on the strings I want to keep? I'll probably try a few more, and wanted to remove those that I don't need. I imagine uninstalling and then reinstalling the software would reset everything, but seems a bit extreme.

PS. I posted my last message twice, not sure if you can delete one of them (*12/*13).