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Thread: RE: Ripping Level Question (help?)

  1. #151
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Hi,

    I thought I would visit 'PC World' (20 x mins drive away) this afternoon to see if I could test-drive one of their Sony 'A35' models. I checked beforehand to make sure they had one in stock. The experience was quite interesting:

    They had 3 x models (all 'A35s') albeit in different colours. One of them had a pair of headphones attached (which you could not unplug). This model had the 3 x factory songs (as preloaded by Sony) for demonstration purposes. I listened briefly to all 3 x songs, and they were all too quiet. And at circa 70% the volume 'warning' bleep came on. In other words, exactly the same results as mine.

    I then tested the other two (different coloured) models, but through a set of headphones (Sennhieser) of my own which I had brought. Again, I experienced the exact same results from these two also.

    So I called over the salesman - who was useless! And so he called for an audio expert so help me instead.

    The second guy came along and basically he just fed me a load of baloney! He said that it was in fact 'PC World' who had set the 'limiter' and not Sony; so as to protect the ears of youngsters fooling around (not the sexual meaning Garym!) in the store. And that if I purchased the same Walkman from them, it would not have this 'limiter' applied. I asked if I could try one out (ie. out of the box) before purchasing? He said this would not be practical because there would be no (demo) music on the device. He continued that Sony specifically only put the 3 x demo songs on Walkmans which are to be placed on the shelf for display/demo purposes. And that these 3 x songs are not actually loaded onto the models sold to customers. Yet, MINE has the exact same 3 x songs preloaded!?

    He kept trying to get me to buy it and said if I was not happy then I could bring it back and get a CREDIT NOTE! F*** that!

    Cheers,

    Paul
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-05-2017 at 02:26 PM. Reason: spelling

  2. #152
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    I'd rather cut off a finger than talk to an "audio expert" at a big box store. Heck, I mostly find the "experts" at audiophile stereo shops to be entirely ignorant of most things digital. Too many old guys (of course I'm even older) with a complete misunderstanding of the science and engineering of networking and digital music reproduction. It's usually so off the wall that I find it more humorous than anything.

  3. #153
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by garym View Post
    I'd rather cut off a finger than talk to an "audio expert" at a big box store. Heck, I mostly find the "experts" at audiophile stereo shops to be entirely ignorant of most things digital. Too many old guys (of course I'm even older) with a complete misunderstanding of the science and engineering of networking and digital music reproduction. It's usually so off the wall that I find it more humorous than anything.
    Hi Gary,

    Well, 40 x mins driving plus 20 x mins in the store was kinda worth it just to compare the Walkman's functionality against my own.

    But I agree, in general, that most sales-tech guys are dorks!

    In the case of this afternoon at 'PC World', either the guy was bluntly lying, or else he was a complete idiot. In any event, I did not let on that I already had, in fact, much experience with the device in question.

    Paul

    NB. I forgot to add, the sales rep also advised me that if a Sony music-player device has been designed/restricted so as to produce a lower 'dB range' than it's rival manufacturers equivalents, then the reason for this is because Sony Walkman models feature a mode called 'High Quality'. He said that Sony value 'High Quality' audio above volume capabilities, and that playing/listening to music LOUD will jeopardize the luxury and exclusiveness of this specific mode.
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-05-2017 at 04:28 PM. Reason: spelling

  4. #154
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Oggy View Post
    I've found you to be courteous, amusing, factual; and considering your volume issue, remarkably apolitical.

    As you have gone through perfecting your ripping methods, asking incredibly logical questions, I believe you have helped many with your screenshots (I really ought to read up how to post them!) and used smart ways of populating the tags, in a repeatable and timely manner.

    More significantly, you've shown the importance of trying a file, on your own player, at the earliest opportunity.

    I for one, salute you all, and couldn't agree more when garym says, this is a friendly, helpful place.
    Hi Oggy,

    Thanks a lot mate. I appreciate that.

    I am aged 48 and relatively new to computers (as you can probably tell!). It takes me a while to get to grips with things, but I generally do persevere. I did a basic 'Music Tech.' course a couple of years back and it really helped me gain confidence (with 'Cubase', etc).

    I bought a video software called 'CamTasia' a couple of years back (to use for my 'You Tube' self-created music uploads). Because I got Educational Discount, I also purchased 'Snag-It' - which is like a sophisticated version of 'Paint', if you will. I enjoy learning how to use it to make my screen-grabs with. And, as you say, it makes answering questions appreciably easier (a picture paints a 1,000 words!).

    Interestingly, the main thing which appeals to me most about this site is that everyone appears to have an excellent command of 'SPaG' (spelling, punctuation and grammar). I fail to understand many of the replies I have received on previous forums I once frequented) because of the constant use of text-speak and abbreviations. For instance, using numbers to replace letters and terms such as 'AFAICR' ("as far as I can recall"!).

    Cheers,

    Paul
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-05-2017 at 03:48 PM. Reason: spelling

  5. #155
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by monsterjazzlick View Post
    Hi Gary,

    Well, 40 x mins driving plus 20 x mins in the store was kinda worth it just to compare the Walkman's functionality against my own.

    But I agree, in general, that most sales-tech guys are dorks!

    In the case of this afternoon at 'PC World', either the guy was bluntly lying, or else he was a complete idiot. In any event, I did not let on that I already had, in fact, much experience with the device in question.

    Paul

    NB. I forgot to add, the sales rep also advised me that if a Sony music-player device has been designed/restricted so as to produce a lower 'dB range' than it's rival manufacturers equivalents, then the reason for this is because Sony Walkman models feature a mode called 'High Quality'. He said that Sony value 'High Quality' audio above volume capabilities, and that playing/listening to music LOUD will jeopardize the luxury and exclusiveness of this specific mode.
    Hi Paul,

    That wasn't the shopping experience, I was hoping you would have! Occasionally I've stumbled across a really clued-up salesman in one of these superstores, who knows the stock inside out, owns the best the shop sells, and dreams of working in a specialist shop.

    You obviously weren't so lucky! I guess those days are long gone, and probably even the lure of very good Hi-Fi, is nowhere near as strong, in the era of disposable, downloaded music.

    Would you be happy with your Sony, if you could resolve the volume issue?

    Long after I stopped selling Hi-Fi, I was wasting a but of time in one of those large electrical outlets, and unusually didn't get pounced on, with seconds of entering the store. Neither did the guy who was pacing along the VCR rack - this was a few years ago! After both of us, had not been acknowledged for 10 minutes, I said, hi, and asked the other bloke what he was after. We had a quick chat, and I said I bought product A, myself, because of the picture quality and reliability. He literally had to drag a salesman away from their private chat, to buy the product. The shop really did not deserve the sale, and I should have got the commission!

    Strangely enough, a couple years later, I went to an open interview day, and when they found out about my Hi-Fi retail past, told me that, the very same shop, had a Manager position going. I seriously considered taking the job, but could never have lived with myself, for the need to hard sell, (largely useless) extended warranties, to boost the very basic wage, to a survivable level.

    I totally share, garym's disdain towards the salesman, in these places, and if I really need to buy from there, and haven't 100% made up my own mind, before entering the store, use this little ploy:-

    Mention, I was a salesman, so cut the bull, and hard sell. The salesman often smiles and becomes a bit more chilled, even approaching being a normal human; I ask what they use at home.

    After they have talked about what they own, and what they aspire to, (salesmen often enjoy talking!), I then ask the real question. Would you, buy, product A, or product B? It is amazing how often, they will tell you about the unreliability issues of product A, and that their colleague being delighted with product B.

    If product B ties in with my short list, I'll follow up with, "so in my position, you would buy product B, for yourself?" Yes! Me, "what's your best price?!" "Can you write that down for me?"

    This, unsurprisingly, doesn't always work, but sometimes does, and always makes visits to these superstores, much more fun!

    In the more specialist shops I worked, and later managed, all staff were salaried, and we sold the brands, we either owned, or aspired to: not a bad business model! This was a joy, and you could, unbelievably and unusually, for a salesman, actually tell the truth!!

    Regards,

    Oggy

    P.S. Have you attempted ripping, a double CD, yet?!
    Last edited by Oggy; 08-06-2017 at 06:47 AM.

  6. #156
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    I agree with the comments made here, by garym and oggy.

    You can check out kit and pick up the odd bargain, but sadly, in my experience, you don't get knowledgeable IT advice, let alone audio advice from the likes of PC World.

    Also, in more recent times (and I can only comment on the UK), priorities for high-street business no longer include decent customer advice/support, which is why I believe these forums (and others) are invaluable. I'd do my homework online, then, when I've narrowed down my preferred options. I'd take my headphones with me to test the devices, before purchasing.

    I recall 5 years ago, the discussions I had with my audio dealer about a new surround sound processor. To confirm what I had read and the advice on offer, I was able to negotiate a demo/loan at home to check out the performance with my amp and speakers, before purchasing. Needless to say, I was very satisfied with this more personal approach to advice/support.

  7. #157
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Hi Oggy,

    I spent a couple of weeks researching and whittling down various 'mp3' players on the market. Most of them looked/read awful - unless you purchased an iPod (which is not for me). And I have always trusted Sony (I never buy a cheap brand). I had read some negative comments about the device, but no more so than other rival units suffered. I did read something about the 'volume' issue (it may have been on the actual Sony forum), but a few people had found adequate workarounds (eg. installing a d/l from Japan, or by reformat, etc). However, I did not expect the lowness of the volume to be so drastic!

    So what I am trying to say is that I didn't go in blindfolded.

    No, I have not tried ripping a double-CD as yet. Miles Davis released so many single-albums that I have not even managed to plough my way through those as yet - nor do I own them all (I can't see how anyone possible can!). But I will try later tonight because I feel the suspense is killing you! Actually, I would like to see the results for myself.

    Cheers.
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-06-2017 at 09:13 AM. Reason: spelling

  8. #158
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by mville View Post
    You can check out kit and pick up the odd bargain, but sadly, in my experience, you don't get knowledgeable IT advice, let alone audio advice from the likes of PC World.

    Also, in more recent times (and I can only comment on the UK), priorities for high-street business no longer include decent customer advice/support, which is why I believe these forums (and others) are invaluable. I'd do my homework online, then, when I've narrowed down my preferred options. I'd take my headphones with me to test the devices, before purchasing.
    Mville,

    I think - and I am sure this is true - that 'PC World' employs Saturday staff over a weekend? For instance, students who need to earn a few bucks between study time. If that is the case, then when in search of technical advice, you may as well save yourself the time and petrol expenses and simply ask Fred down though road for his opinion!

    Yes, I took a pair of headphones with me into the store yesterday. And it's a good job I did because they provided NONE (apart from a set which was hard-fixed to a device)!

    Paul
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-06-2017 at 09:21 AM. Reason: spelling

  9. #159
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by monsterjazzlick View Post
    Hi Oggy,

    I spent a couple of weeks researching and whittling down various 'mp3' players on the market. Most of them looked/read awful - unless you purchased an iPod (which is not for me). And I have always trusted Sony (I never buy a cheap brand). I had read some negative comments about the device, but no more so than other rival units suffered. I did read something about the 'volume' issue (it may have been on the actual Sony forum), but a few people had found adequate workarounds (eg. installing a d/l from Japan, or by reformat, etc). However, I did not expect the lowness of the volume to be so drastic!

    So what I am trying to say is that I didn't go in blindfolded.

    No, I have not tried ripping a double-CD as yet. Miles Davis released so many single-albums that I have not even managed to plough my way through those as yet - nor do I own them all (I can't see how anyone possible can!). But I will try later tonight because I feel the suspense is killing you! Actually, I would like to see the results for myself.

    Cheers.
    Ha, I mentioned the double CD, to end the post back on track!

    Funnily enough, an iPod, is the only Apple product that I've ever owned. I use it in the car, and sometimes at work, when the limited play list on the radio, gets too repetitive. Via my Shure, in ear buds, and playing MP3 files at 320kb/s, it produces a good sound. When it packs up, I really don't know what I'd replace it with. Possibly another iPod, an Astell & Kern, if I was in single man mode, but more probably a generic 40, Chinese MP3 player, in my responsible, married with child position!

    As always, some players offer more flexibility with tags than others.

    Originally I was going to sell my soul to the devil, probably my car, and the contents of my house, to buy an up market music player. As a stop gap, I looked at a 100 DAC. For very similar money, garym, suggested a s/h Logitech Squeezebox Touch, and I'm very pleased he did. If you don't need a portable player, maybe this may suit your needs? You do need a computer to load the Logitech Media Software (LMS) onto, but the player and apps, may give you, more of the flexibility, you ideally would like, with the tags.

    Many a good sounding player, has been lessened, by poor software

    To finish by getting the post back on track, dBpoweramp, has the flexibility, to cope with most players and apps idiosyncrasies!!

    Regards,

    Oggy

  10. #160
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Hi Oggy,

    I have just ripped a double CD ('Dark Magus' - Miles Davis).

    I have a Master-Folder (call it what you will) entitled: 'monsterjazzlicks_FLAC' (within in My-Music) on my PC. It currently has a Miles Davis CD I ripped last week ('Filles de ... "), and now also the double-CD ('Dark Magus').

    Double_CD.jpg

    As you can see, Disc 1 and 2 (of 'Dark Magus') are as separate folders. Should I KEEP it this way? Or would you place the double-CD into a single folder (entitled: 'Dark Magus'); hence creating a sub-folder? Or just leave them as they are (hangin' loose), please - which may cause may cause disorganization as per next paragraph ...

    At the moment I am working my way thru my Miles collection, but at some point I will be moving to the next artist/band. In which case, should I create a FOLDER for each artist/band? And place the respective recordings of each artist/band into them.

    On my external HD, I have a dedicated FOLDER for each artist/band, even if there is only 1 x CD in there. But whether or not this might make any difference to the average Walkman player (ie. drag&dropping 'sub-folders') is something I am really not sure about. please?

    Many thanks,

    Paul
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-06-2017 at 12:41 PM. Reason: spelling

  11. #161
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    Question Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Oggy View Post
    Ha, I mentioned the double CD, to end the post back on track!
    Hi Oggy,

    Ripping my first double-CD appears to have been a successful mission as far as I can tell. I used the same ripping and tagging process as for a single-CD. And it has labeled the double-CD as 'Disc-1' and 'Disc-2' respectively.

    Paul

  12. #162
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by monsterjazzlick View Post
    Hi Oggy,

    Ripping my first double-CD appears to have been a successful mission as far as I can tell. I used the same ripping and tagging process as for a single-CD. And it has labeled the double-CD as 'Disc-1' and 'Disc-2' respectively.

    Paul
    i prefer not to have disc number in my album title. You can turn this off in ripper settings.

  13. #163
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by garym View Post
    i prefer not to have disc number in my album title. You can turn this off in ripper settings.
    Gary,

    Oh, really? Well then here's where you and I differ! Ha ha ...

    Cheers mate.
    Last edited by monsterjazzlick; 08-06-2017 at 03:03 PM. Reason: spelling

  14. #164
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    Lightbulb Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by monsterjazzlick View Post
    Gary,

    Oh, really? Well then here's where you and I differ! Ha ha ...

    Cheers mate.
    thats why there are options.
    ps. For me it's because I like my player to treat a single album as a single album even though it may be spread out over more than one disc. In terms of file naming and organization, I do have each disc in its own sub folder under the album folder.
    Last edited by garym; 08-06-2017 at 03:14 PM.

  15. #165
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    Re: Ripping Level Question (help?)

    Quote Originally Posted by monsterjazzlick View Post
    Hi Oggy,

    I have just ripped a double CD ('Dark Magus' - Miles Davis).

    I have a Master-Folder (call it what you will) entitled: 'monsterjazzlicks_FLAC' (within in My-Music) on my PC. It currently has a Miles Davis CD I ripped last week ('Filles de ... "), and now also the double-CD ('Dark Magus').

    Double_CD.jpg

    As you can see, Disc 1 and 2 (of 'Dark Magus') are as separate folders. Should I KEEP it this way? Or would you place the double-CD into a single folder (entitled: 'Dark Magus'); hence creating a sub-folder? Or just leave them as they are (hangin' loose), please - which may cause may cause disorganization as per next paragraph ...

    At the moment I am working my way thru my Miles collection, but at some point I will be moving to the next artist/band. In which case, should I create a FOLDER for each artist/band? And place the respective recordings of each artist/band into them.

    On my external HD, I have a dedicated FOLDER for each artist/band, even if there is only 1 x CD in there. But whether or not this might make any difference to the average Walkman player (ie. drag&dropping 'sub-folders') is something I am really not sure about. please?

    Many thanks,

    Paul
    Garym's naming scheme, which I believe you are using, will create an Artist folder, for each Artist, automatically. This is a good thing. As you can see, you now have two Albums, in your Miles Davis, folder. This is also a good thing! When you search on Miles, all his albums, will show.

    I believe that you preferred having Disc 1, and Disc 2, as your Album name, so you have exactly what you want.

    As I mentioned, somewhere in Don's thread, I don't have Disc 1, Disc 2, in the Album name, but this is entirely a personal preference. A triple album, works exactly the same, and garym's naming string, does Compilations, both single, and multi-disc, too.

    Happy days!

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